Responsible for kits?

[Megan.]

When we decide to breed, are we responsible for the kits if mom won't nurse? Is it our responsbility to insure they are being fed on time, and are getting food?

[Megan.]

I feel when you put a male and female together, in a cage- YOU are responsible for what happens. If a mother has 20 kits and can't feed them- YOU are now "mom" and it is YOUR job to do the work. THat means getting up day and night to do it.

My opinion? You cant do it- don't breed. If you refuse to help kits, and consider yourself a "pet breeder" you have NO place to breed. If you won't feed kits, you have NO place breeding.

[bear]

i am not sure of my opinion on this topic, so i'll put forward a couple points.

the runt might always be the runt. natural selection.

i am curious to know from people who have done a lot of handfeeding (not one or two) what the general results are. how many die (let's face it, despite anybody's best efforts some just won't make it) and how many turn out as big and as nice as others who aren't handfed. also, is there a marked difference in temperament? i suspect (but could be wrong) that you won't get as many show winners by handfeeding, but you'll get some real sweethearts that would be really wonderful pets.

ranchers (in general) can't hand feed. they don't have the resources, or the time. however, they do have a resource that hobby breeders don't - more nursing chins. so they are able to foster out kits.

one large breeder was dead-on when he said at the shindig... when you're smaller, everything is more precious.

[tigerbabygrr]

I don't know about most of the large ranchers...but I do know about Shoots. He recently had a litter of 6 born and he was hand feeding them. They were getting enough milk but he didn't want to risk it. They were hand fed from day one. He had some other litters last time I was there that needed supplementing as well and while we were going through the barn he was feeding them. He doesn't feed them every two hours on the nose, but he does at least do the best he can. When you have upwards of 10 babies or more born a day, sometimes it's the best you can do...Plus he already has over 2,000 others to take care of.

Here at Jason's apartment with 17 animals, we hand feed every two hours if and when it's needed. Since we are so small at the moment it's tougher to lose one or two.

You do take responsibility for the kits once a female and a male are put together. It doesn't matter if the pairing was done out of ignorance or not. The owner of those two animals IS responsible.

[Megan.]

my post isn't about "ranchers". Mine is people who claim to be pet breeders.

A pet breeder to me, would do anything possible to keep the kits alive. They would handfeed if needed- and TRY. Not turn their backs on a kit and let it die.

When I breed, I know full well that if mom won't/can't take care of her kits- it is MY job. Because I bred, I knew of the possiblity something can happen to mom, where she can't nurse all the kits- and it is my responsiblity to do all I can for those kits.

lets face it- if I didn't put those two chins together, those kits wouldn't be here. It was my choice to put them together, and my responsibilty to care for the outcome of my putting two chins together.

[tigerbabygrr]

Sorry I was just bouncing off of what Bear was saying.

I agree with you, Megan. I am responsible for putting a male and female together. If they have kit(s) and the mother will not nurse the kit(s) for whatever reason, it is my job to step in and help which might mean I need to hand feed or rotate. I'm not going to sit there and let the kits starve to death. I'm going to at least try to keep them full and healthy. Sometimes you do your best and the kit still won't make it...but if you didn't try it wouldn't have made it that far.

The first litter born here was a set of twins. The standard was born deformed and the TOV beige violet was a pretty good weight. Mom did not get any milk for three weeks. I kept the little deformed baby alive for almost two weeks. I knew she wouldn't make it but I wanted to give her a chance. I wanted her with me as long as possible. She was moving and was able to open her mouth, so she was hand fed.

I don't understand why someone breeds a pair of animals and expects the best to happen. When breeding, you have to expect the worst so you are prepared. And when you breed, you are responsible for the offspring if mother will not care for it. If it's too much for you to handle, then don't breed.

[jencortinas]

**Fingers crossed** I have not had to hand feed yet. But on the same hand I have lost kits due to no one's fault...some just died, mom killed them, etc. Some just do not make it. Of course I make all efforts to help the mom. I do feel responsible for the babies...afterall I had a hand in creating them!!!

[bear]

Okay, just hobby breeders then. :) (I'm thoroughly impressed that Shoots has the time to handfeed...I knew there'd be some exception to that generalization!)

I honestly expect that, just because everything is precious when there are so few animals, that most people do everything they can to make sure their kits survive. My objections are greatest when somebody could very reasonably take action, but doesn't. Then again, what is reasonable?

[dawn]

The topic should not be limited to kits, we are responsible for our chins at any age and should do what needs to be done to ensure good health. I have had to hand feed adults around the clock. Its not fun but it needed to be done and there was no easy excuse avaliable not to do it. When I was told it needed to be done I did it without argument.

[Megan.]

I have handfeed a kit. 8 weeks straight, every 2 hours day and night. Without me, this kit would have been DEAD. mom was a first time mom, and fed the 2 strongest kits, but not him. He is now living in an awesome home, with his brother and littermate.

I did try handfeeding my latest litter- but they didn't have the will to survive. But guess what? I can say I TRIED.